Who has the last say on cancelling/ abandoning a game

Discussion in 'Game Management & Communication' started by controller, Dec 7, 2008.

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  1. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    Interesting!

    I refer you to a post I made on a different thread. There certainly appear to be two (very different) sides to this story.

    I love the way that a couple of things have been posted on here recently and the 'combatants' have come on line to discuss their varying views of events. If nothing else, these discussions certainly go to show how difficult the umpires' job is, when two people participating in the same event, seeing the same incidents, interpret them so differently*. It just goes to show that a belief in the certainty of "one truth" about an event is dangerous - perhaps something that we umpires should remember when we're certain we've seen something but everyone else appears to disagree...

    * Max, I appreciate that Controller wasn't at the game in question, but clearly someone has relayed a version of events to him that is somewhat at odds with yours!
     
  2. Max Boyce

    Max Boyce FHF Newbie

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    Red,

    I appreciate that there are two sides to a story, however it is disingenuous to suggest that the two umpires were in disagreement and would not sign the match record. I don’t consider myself a combatant, merely wanted to correct those inaccuracies. Umpiring is a difficult job especially when events are misrepresented. For the avoidance of doubt my colleague on the day corroborated “my version†before I posted.

    Max
     
  3. controller

    controller FHF Legend

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    Max

    Since you have just joined I assume another poster on here told you about this post and Hey, that is my game!!

    Well, I was trying to get what other umpires would do, this was not done as a battle of words with you or the teams involved.

    Some of your facts are different from mine but if you would like to contact me via email or through my mobile I will discuss the emails from people who were there for both clubs and your colleague, as I do not want to take this to the personal attack that this seems to be.
     
  4. justin-old

    justin-old FHF Legend

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    Hence my assertion elsewhere that however certain we may be that we are "100% correct", our perceptions of events are not necessarily what might subsequently be shown by replays of pitch-side camera(s).
    A little humility is no bad quality.... :)
     
  5. Max Boyce

    Max Boyce FHF Newbie

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    Controller,

    I’m not sure what is left to discuss but feel free to call me. I would have thought that the time to talk this over was before you posted.

    If you were really doing this for educational purposes then all you had to ask was what should happen if two umpires disagree on the pitch conditions. You did not have to relate it to a particular game, especially one in which the umpires did not disagree.

    As for not making it personal I’d hate to be on the receiving end of one that you did. Let’s recall that according to you I am a club umpire (which presumably impairs my judgement). Also in your opinion based on hearsay I had lost control of the game. Why did you feel the need to qualify the issue with these comments ?

    So having attempted to explain my decision by your comments let’s turn to the real issue which is the fact that my colleague agreed that the pitch was playable. Had he disagreed then the match would have been abandoned. However by “standing firm†as Redumpire recommended he was pilloried by “his†own team, officials and supporters. As you know when umpires are treated like this they tend to vote with their feet, and a valuable resource is lost.

    If you want to discuss further then please call but I think as far as the forum is concerned we can bring this particular thread to a conclusion.
     
  6. foozbear

    foozbear FHF Regular Player

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    in all fairness...many of us have given examples of games we have seen or officiated.

    All I got from the post was...

    when the umpires think its safe to play and a team doesnt....who has the ultimate control. I dont think anyone else looked into this and thought anything different.

    we have had a situation where the umpires thought it was ok to play...the temp dropped during play and the pitch literally froze while playing. falling over, it felt like concrete...

    so if someone tells you its ok to walk across fire...will you do it? some sense of reason must be established...

    if the officials believe the field to be playable...only thing to do is walk off the field and call the game yourselves for safeties sake. Then its up to the league how they proceed.

    thats my overall sumation of the event.
     
  7. Goalie64

    Goalie64 FHF All Time Great

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    Max - thank you for clarifying the situation.
    Hope you'll stick around on the forum.
    As has been often said " you have/had to be there" to be able to fully appreciate any situation, which is why perhaps hypothetical situations should be posited.

    Hopefully all is now done and dusted and we can move on from the storm in a "sospan fach"

    PS - England 62 for 0 at lunch
     
  8. controller

    controller FHF Legend

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    Max

    OK, I have to apologise to the forum, my post was reported to the league in question and I have had my hand slapped.
    My understanding of British Law and my human rights is that free speech is still allowed and for the last 30 years whilst I have played, umpired, administered in the game of Hockey, it has been that you could mentioned incidents but not the game in specific or name the umpires.

    At no time in this post, have I actually done that

    I have never mentioned the game in question or the two clubs involved, everybody on here have seen the club name I am associated with and hey presto!!

    The thread started with the following question


    I am after some feedback.

    1.    Who can request a match to be called off before it starts
    2.    Captain requests that a pitch is dangerous what should the umpires do.
    3.  After 50 minutes, 3 players injured due to slipping over, captain requests that the game be cancelled. 1  umpire agrees but the other disagrees, advice.

    Thanks


    In the long run there are 2 halves to each stories and details get missed out or are changed, so difference of accounts will always happen.
    I have tried to get your contact details from the teams involved in this incident but hey they have not bothered to return my calls but what's is new there!!
    I sent you a private message on here, and if you really wanted to talk you would have replied with your details so I could of contact yourself instead of doing this through the forum.

    So as far as I am concerned this matter is closed and I would like the moderators to lock this thread.
     
  9. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    I think we've established what needed to be established. Let's lock the thread and move on.
     
  10. Max Boyce

    Max Boyce FHF Newbie

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    Diolch Goalie. Nice summary. As Churchill might have said, never was so much written about so little for the benefit of so few.

    I'll be back !
     
  11. Max Boyce

    Max Boyce FHF Newbie

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    Controller,

    Apology accepted. Hands slapped and hopefully lessons learnt.
    Free speech is ok but perjury is still illegal.
    You kept my name out of it but you gave me too many clues that this was my game.
    Anyway I’ve replied to your pm and the phone lines are open.
    Mine’s a lager and whatever my colleague’s drinking.

    Diolch

    Max
     
  12. PabloCasino

    PabloCasino FHF Starter

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    Max, thanks for the new word in my vocabulary too.

    I know I'm not on my own to have googled - Diolch
     
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