Management & Communication Signal for 23m restart - video clips?

Discussion in 'Outdoor Umpiring Questions & General Chat' started by Diligent, Sep 5, 2017.

  1. Diligent

    Diligent FHF All Time Great
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    Does anyone know of video clips showing correct and effective signalling for the 23m restart, as per Rule 7.4b and Umpiring 4.3c:
    ball out of play over the back-line unintentionally by a
    defender: using right or left arm as appropriate, with
    the arm well below shoulder level, draw an imaginary
    line from the point where the ball crossed the back-line
    to the point on the 23 metres line from which the restart
    should be taken​

    It would be useful to see 'official' views on what that looks like in practice, as my habitual signal has attracted some criticism, but (as is often the way) different coaches have different ideas?

    Mostly the ball goes off on the umpire's right (goal side), so the right arm signals. Do we use the left arm only when the ball goes off on the umpire's left (nearer the corner) or, as per the old 'corner' signal, the left for anywhere the umpire's side of the goal?
     
  2. george

    george FHF Starter

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    I would be interested to see some guidance.

    I find myself resorting to verbal instructions, since the signals are often confusing.
     
  3. The chief

    The chief FHF Legend

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    Sounds simple enough to me, although that's never stopped umpires making a meal of anything before. Surely you just point at where it went off, then "draw" an imaginary line running 90 degrees from the baseline to the 23m line with your hand / finger?
     
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  4. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    What @The chief said...

    Failing that, watch any of the videos available via https://www.eurohockeytv.org/. At some point you'll see someone using the appropriate signal.

    EDIT: Try at approx. 2:00 into this one.

    Why do I have the feeling that this thread has great Molehill > Mountain potential...? :(
     
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  5. careeman

    careeman FHF Legend

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    I can't believe I'm about to give a serious answer to this but here goes......

    I've been using the signal since resumption of the English National League after Xmas. At the same time I started using it here I also used it in every other level of game I umpire and it hasn't once caused any confusion to any player at any level.
    That's all the way from boys U14 to mens national premier division (I did one game on the last day of the season, I'm quite proud of that!!:D) and pretty much everything in between.

    Honestly, give the players some credit. They know its a 23m restart or long corner or whatever you want to call it because they saw the ball go over the line the same as you did.

    Be confident, make the signal in your own style using the arm most appropriate to the position it went off (i.e don't look like your landing a plane with semaphore and cross your arms all over your body) and if a coach doesn't like it then tell them to get a life!!
    I still back it up with a verbal 'long' as I always did but again players know what this means and if they don't they soon learn.

    At ease gents, and ladies, , its really not that hard. ;):)
     
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  6. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    Wait? What? You knowingly and systematically broke the Rules of Hockey that were in place in England at the time...?
    ;)
     
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  7. careeman

    careeman FHF Legend

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    Yep and there's nothing anyone can do about it.

    Just call me 'Renegade Reeman' from now on. :D
     
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  8. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    I'm sure that NPUA's Chair of Selectors can request that L3 Umpiring status be removed from miscreant members, Renegade...
     
  9. careeman

    careeman FHF Legend

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    I have it on good authority that The NPUA's COS is a thoroughly decent chap, very level headed and not prone to making rash requests as a result of one fairly minor misdemeanour.
    ;):)
     
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  10. Diligent

    Diligent FHF All Time Great
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    What was that about molehills and mountains, @redumpire?

    What I'm getting is not to 'draw' the line, so no droopy pointy fingers or whatever. Just a simple swing of the arm: raise hand to eye level with arm straight and parallel with back line; pause; swing until it's parallel (roughly) with side line; hold briefly; drop. Then manage the taker into the right place before the ball gets there. Play on.

    Now what off-topics can we find for the next 8 pages...?
     
  11. careeman

    careeman FHF Legend

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    On topic............

    Focus on the taker and the setup. Correct location, stopped ball, 5m etc. You know, the important stuff.

    Honestly, forget the signal hardly anyone looks anyway.
     
  12. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    Taking the thread slightly off topic: guilty. Making a mountain out of it: definitely not guilty!
    Sounds perfect, but see @careeman's very sensible comments immediately above this post.
    Nowt from me, I promise. Shall we lock it up? ;)
     
  13. AJF

    AJF FHF Legend

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    Please! All mainly sensible so far! No mention that the arm action can get you mistaken for a member of the village people too...
     
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  14. Diligent

    Diligent FHF All Time Great
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    Umpire coaches look at the signal, especially the way I was doing it - but if that's all there was to criticise, I was probably doing ok.

    And slight correction, having watched a bit more of the match recommended above: swing until it (the arm) is pointing at where to take it (which is not necessarily "parallel with side line").
     
  15. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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  16. Gilly

    Gilly FHF Legend

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    Aww no - all I can hear in my head now is "ohhh Réné" (with apologies to those who have never seen nor heard of the TV programme "'Allo 'Allo!")
     
  17. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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  18. UmpireHockey.com

    UmpireHockey.com FHF All Time Great

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    This is exactly why I'd vote for replacing the broken windmill/pendulum/is-he-pointing FHD signal with a fist in the air. Simple. No videos needed. No confusion. Easily visible from everywhere on the pitch and in the stadium.
     
  19. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    You'll need a signal to indicate the location of the re-start when your fist is in the air. What do you suggest?
     
  20. UmpireHockey.com

    UmpireHockey.com FHF All Time Great

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    Do we? We don't have that for almost every other restart. Sort of with the award of the goal, "Take it out there. I'll show you with both my arms." Penalty stroke...pointing at the spot. Generally we're just indicating the direction of the team and expect the players to put the ball where it needs to go. If they're getting it wrong, we'll take steps needed to direct the players appropriately. It's a good point, though. It, the fist in the air, is also more consistent with the other signals, "Attack ball. Put it where it needs to go." With a 16 we don't include some broken arm signal to indicate where the ball crossed. We don't need it for this either. The main thing is to communicate whether it is a 16 or a 23. Arms wide apart = 16. Fist in the air = 23. Simple.
     
    #20 UmpireHockey.com, Sep 5, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2017

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