Rio 2016 squads announced.

Discussion in 'FIH Tournaments' started by Goalie64, Jun 28, 2016.

  1. Mac

    Mac FHF Legend

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    Is Crutchley the issue though? I think we have to accept we're not that good. The depth of real, international-level talent doesn't seem to be there. Who in our squad (or even the wider performance squad) is truly world class? Over the past few years I take the view only Middleton and Jackson can lay claim to that accolade and both are sadly on the down slope now. Catlin could be on his way into that bracket, in fairness.

    We're a top-10 in the world side, but we're not a top-4 side. We can't compete regularly and consistently with Germany, Holland, Belgium and Australia who have a depth of talent we seem unable to match.
     
  2. DHM_78

    DHM_78 FHF Starter

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    I agree with part of your argument, but I do feel Crutchley is partly to blame as he hasn't looked wider and experimented with the wider performance squad and given them a chance to show themselves at international level? Players want to go to Europe to gain experience but they are told if they want any chance to break into the central squad they have to play in Eng. Why do you think Creed and Goodfield came back from Germany?!! The central squad has been a closed shop over the last 3 years with the odd addition. I think the whole system needs a shake up. As someone else said, look at the squads that are achieving and take advice, not just say we will do it our way and fail. I am sorry that is not the players fault, it is the coaches and management. I do think our players try, but if the coach is not achieving the best out of them, changes are required.
     
  3. DHM_78

    DHM_78 FHF Starter

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    Sorry I don't agree, there has not been enough experimentation with the wider squad or even outside the squad. BC has had a closed shop. Hockey in GB hasn't been working for 4/3years, but the coaches and management keep doing the same old thing hoping the next time it will work. The olympics have shown that we are probably not even in the top 10. I think majority of the boys did their best and have worked hard, they all have a talent but the best has not been brought out of them and we didn't have the flare. I feel very sorry for the boys, it is the job of the coaches to get the best out of them and they didn't. To rely on another country to win and good luck to get through to the 1/4 finals is not good. Has BC actually released a statement yet???
     
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  4. wacker

    wacker FHF Newbie

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    Two observations I'd like to make
    1 England and therefore currently GB men are ranked 4 in the world, for now. So obviously they are doing somethings right, as they've been around that ranking for a few years now. So why didn't they perform according to their ranking at Rio? Ex GB player Ratman made a good point on twitter, underperformance is environmental, not the players fault. That environment is set by the coaching team.
    2 EHL are well aware of the failings in the English league system. It is not intensive enough to prepare athletes for international games, both in fitness terms and improving technical ability. EHL a couple of years ago proposed a franchise system to improve levels of competitiveness, attracting overseas talent, and then hopefully producing a product that would be attractive to TV companies. This was rejected by the top level clubs.

    Discuss. :)
     
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  5. wdyw

    wdyw FHF Legend

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    4th in world, but again you need to look more closely on recent tournaments and how they gained their points.

    CTT this year (at home!) - go in ranked 3rd, finish 4th (underperformed)
    WL last year - go in ranked 4th , finished 6th (underperformed)
    Euros last year (at home)- go in ranked 3rd, finished 4th (underperformed)

    So we need to go back to 2014 for th efirst tournament when they played to their ranking - finishing 4th in the WC.
    THe other tournament that year was a Champions Trophy where they finished 7th

    So you need to go back to the 2012 Olympics and the first WL (2013) to get two tournaments where they played 2 consecutive tournaments to their ranking.

    Ranking points - the biggest contribution by far is from their 4th place in the Euros last year which were seen as a disaster! Near enough 40% of their total ranking points comes from that 1 home tournament!

    We are going to give away a huge amount of points from the Olympics - will they give the bottom 4 teams joint 9th points (450) or the average of 9/10/11/12 points (375 pts?). THe 4 teams below Eng/GB have all qualified for the last 8 and with less than 200pts between the teams I expect a drop to 7/8.

    Anyway, onto point 2, yep, said the same yesterday - televised super league franchise is what we should be aiming for.

    I could not care less what the views of the top clubs were.
     
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  6. Stuart Burnside

    Stuart Burnside FHF All Time Great

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    This gets mentioned a lot & I confess I never understand it. Why do you think a franchise system would generate more interest than an open league?
     
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  7. wdyw

    wdyw FHF Legend

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    Just had a look at the current rankings and with all losing 1/4 finalists getting 200pts more than tose who went home early, plus the 2012 points dropping out completely (even though they are only factored in at 25% atm, we lose more than our "rivals") ... I reckon we do drop down to 8th.

    One positive though ....we don't need to worry about not being invited to a CTT because of te poor ranking!
     
  8. DHM_78

    DHM_78 FHF Starter

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    Do you think all those outside the central squad, that put everything into training, keeping fit, gaining experience and made them selves available, all at their own expense will get a chance even though they were discarded pre Rio. You would think or hope there will be changes, will they get called back for trials. Are the coaches selection criteria the right ones and if not were they the right ones for discarding most of the larger squad.. It all went terrible wrong for them at the Olympics it has to be looked out, will the bodies that be except they may have made mistakes.?
     
  9. RenneRs

    RenneRs FHF Starter

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    Will the Australians be doing as much soul searching as we are?

    It could be argued that they have underperformed more than GB. I don't think many would argue that they were the favourites going into the Olympics, but have had some poor performances.
     
  10. horse_blaney

    horse_blaney FHF Newbie

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    I would have put the germans as the favorites, something about them just has the edge on Netherlands in my opinion!

    As for Australia you could sense an exit was coming in this tournament before it started, no talks really of them being favorites, in fact it almost felt like everyone had forgotten about them in terms of medal contention.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  11. horse_blaney

    horse_blaney FHF Newbie

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    Looks like both our predictions were wrong! Belgium Vs Argentina Final, thatll be a saucy game!

    I think perhaps it shows the differences between top nations is dwindling, that there isnt a gulf of quality anymore, that its tactical prowess that is winning games! The importance of a switched on coach looks more prevalent now! (Disclaimer: i do not think that the coaches who didnt make the final are crap, but i bet you if a weak coach did get an international job hed be exposed)


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  12. phi11ip

    phi11ip FHF Top Player

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    Slight change of topic:

    I've been really ignorant with regards to this one so apologies for the really basic question, but I saw 16 players in the womens' squad with no reserve goalkeeper. What happens if Hinch was to have got injured during a match? They've obviously got the travelling reserves, but how does that work?
     
  13. Theory

    Theory FHF Legend

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    Kirsty MacKay was the reserve keeper.

    Edit to say I see I misunderstood what you meant.
     
    #153 Theory, Aug 24, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2016
  14. ironman

    ironman FHF Top Player

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    During the match, either one of the outfield players who has practised with the pads on goes in or they play with 11 outfield players/10 with a kicking back for the remainder of the game.
     
  15. philthy

    philthy FHF All Time Great

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    If she'd got injured during a match then they would have had to either play with no keeper, a PWGKP, or someone else from the matchday 16 would have kitted up... Then if she was too injured to play any further part in the tournament Kirsty McKay would have taken her place.

    It's a gamble. You don't have a keeper in the 16, you have 5 sets of fresh legs to come on... you do have a keeper, you're down to 4 subs.

    Brazil men were the only team I saw with 2 GKs in the 16 (might have been others but I didn't spot them).
     
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  16. phi11ip

    phi11ip FHF Top Player

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    Perfect. That answers it. At first I'd assumed that someone had got a gold medal for sitting on the bench the entire time, but then realised there was nobody left in the squad!

    I've seen quite a few matches over the past few years where teams switch keepers towards to give them a runaround, but obviously didn't seen any during the Olympics. Very risky, but then again I can't remember the last time I saw a keeper go off injured?
     
  17. Seive

    Seive FHF Top Player

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    On the franchise point, the proposition was a bit unrealistic with a number of barriers to overcome, not least financing which was based on an assumption of selling a minimum number of tickets at a set price every week. This number was more than currently attend the national league playoffs over the whole weekend let alone a weekly prem game which has max 900 min 25 person attendance. Couple this with the lack of consistent infrastructure, sponsors, high performance coaches and it was hard to see how it could have worked.

    The main reason clubs rejected it was that it would have made clubs participation level only as high performance players and talent development would have shifted to one of 5 franchises which were run by the person with the deepest pockets in the region.
     
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  18. two goal debut

    two goal debut FHF Starter

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    The Olympic football squads were 18 players. I presume all the teams included 2 goalkeepers.
     
  19. MunchkinGK

    MunchkinGK FHF All Time Great

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    Brazil switched their keeper against GB.
     
  20. phi11ip

    phi11ip FHF Top Player

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    I lost interest in that match, which is why I missed it. Nice to know that 100% of the spare goalkeepers in the Olympics got some match time though!
     

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