Attacking GK committing offence at PC

Discussion in 'PS and Goalkeeping' started by wwjnr, Mar 11, 2008.

  1. wwjnr

    wwjnr FHF Newbie

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    Attacking PC at end of half with umpires having blown for time, PC to be completed.
    Attacking teams GK (fully kitted, pads, kickers, gloces & helmet) comes out of 22 and stands near the 1/2 way line.

    Have now seen this three times - what should the decision(s) be?
    Does 10.1a apply? If so FHD and corner over and 1/2 or full time comes into effect?

    What happens if this occurrs during the game? If a GK offence what penalty (FH? & personal?)?
     
  2. Bodgecampbell

    Bodgecampbell FHF Regular Player

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    I'm sure this has been covered somewhere before, but:

    I'd have thought a bit of common sense would prevail. If the keeper isn't playing the ball, or otherwise interfering with play they have gained no advantage from standing where they are, therefore, no penalty should be applied.
     
  3. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    Where's Keely when you need her...?!

    I agree with Bodge. In the "over-time" PC situation you have to consider what advantage the GK is gaining by standing near the half-way line, or what possible impact his/her doing so could have on the game. I would argue, very strongly, that the answer is none and s/he can, therefore, be safely ignored.

    In the second scenario, do you mean that the GK comes out of the 23m area while there is a PC at the other end? If so, I think you simply advise him/her quietly that he/she needs to return to the area. If your initial polite request is met with a refusal, I would stop the time and advise him/her quite clearly that he/she needs to do as you ask. If he/she still refuses I would award a free hit to the team defending the PC at the point where the GK is standing outside the 23m and award the GK a green card. However, I would hope that by managing the situation quiety and calmly in the first place that I would simply not get to this point.

    If you mean the GK comes out of the 23m area during normal play you would need to consider all kinds of issues: was it deliberate? did s/he can an advantage from the action? what did s/he actually do while outside the 23? etc. etc. Depending on the answers to those questions, you then have a range of possible measures from a quiet word to a free hit and a yellow card. From a technical point of view, I don't think you could give a PC as the offence would have been outside the 23, but I'm sure you would be able to 'sell' such a decision if the foul merited it...

    Hope that helps?
     
  4. braxer001

    braxer001 FHF Legend

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    I'm not a 100% sure, but I thought a keeper is only commiting an offence when he is participating in the play outside the 23m. Participating as in being in the vicinity of the ball, so playing it or running close to it with attackers nearby,... but not as in 'cheering on' his team :)

    Anyway, common sense applies, the keeper has no effect on the attacking pc at all (unless he's trying to distract the other keeper ;)) so no disadvantage to anyone so no foul.
     
  5. keely

    keely FHF Legend

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    Right here. :) And we're all repeating ourselves now!

    It's all about prevention, not "gotcha" umpiring.

    When time has been extended in order to complete a PC, the PC would be over before the GK would get remotely close to participating in the play. I wouldn't even ask them to return to the circle, but as the non-engaged umpire just remind them to stay put around the centre line. You're showing that you're not pedantic and by making a small allowance, engendering some goodwill. If you speak loudly enough for the defending players at the line to hear, they know that you're aware of the situation and there won't be any mistakes made with regard to the GK being allowed to join in the PC. Everyone's on the same page, everyone's happy, it's all good.
     
  6. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    Keely, not sure if you're agreeing with me here or gently upbraiding me for "gotcha" umpiring. I hope it's not the latter as I cannot abide that style of umpiring, as I know you know.

    Just to be clear, I am saying that if the GK came out of the 23m area during a PC at any time in the game other than during "overtime" I would simply (and quietly) ask them quietly to return to the area. If they did it during an overtime PC I would ignore them, unless they tried to involve themselves in the taking of the PC in some way.
     
  7. keely

    keely FHF Legend

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    Absolutely red, we are (as always) on the same page.
     
  8. nerd_is_the_word

    nerd_is_the_word FHF All Time Great

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    ohhh man you guys are so boring when you agree all the time. I wanna see you fight!!!!

    Ohhh keely dont say that about red's mother im sure she is a loving woman :p
     
  9. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    We keep our fights to IMs...

    And I know that Keely is far too well-mannered to pass judgement on my mum even if she'd met her, NITW! ;)
     
  10. keely

    keely FHF Legend

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    NITW, you'd be happy to know we're having a knock-down, drag-'em-out fight over music via PM. However, I like other people's moms a lot since I lost mine years ago, so I won't be dragging any moms into it. I'll just keep it to grammatically-correct incisiveness (and yes, of course I'm winning!). ;)
     
  11. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    I'm not sure I'd describe anything the New Pornographers have produced as "music" Keely...

    Anyway, I'm off to watch the disappointing-but-still-watchable Ashes to Ashes on catch up TV. Night all!
     
  12. keely

    keely FHF Legend

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    Yeah? You're smelly.
     
  13. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    Whatever. :p

    BTW, I wish to revise my opinion of Ashes to Ashes from "disappointing-but-still-watchable" to "disappointing-and-increasingly-unwatchable". (And does anybody know what the Simple Minds' track they used in the last episode was? Was it I Travel? Edit: It was.)
     
  14. justin-old

    justin-old FHF Legend

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    As I've said before, it seems a very silly thing for keepers to do, to ignore the 'advice' of an umpire regarding their behaviour, at any point in the game, however 'right' they think they are, or how 'petty' they consider the advice .....it usually leads to tears ;)
     
  15. Snoody

    Snoody FHF All Time Great

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    Red vs Keely in a private death-match... ah the images just keep on flying into my mind.
    Anyone got an inflatable 12ft-diameter paddling pool, 48 pints of gently warmed Nutella, a Borat mankini, and Diana Rigg's catsuit from The Avengers...?

    Snoody :p
     
  16. redumpire

    redumpire FHF All Time Great
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    I don't think that catsuit would fit me Snoody... :eek:oh:

    (PS You really do need to get out more!)
     
  17. philthy

    philthy FHF All Time Great

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    Snoody I worry about your fantasies!
     
  18. keely

    keely FHF Legend

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    Nutella? You're done. I request a Borat mankini in lilac, please.
     
  19. Snoody

    Snoody FHF All Time Great

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    Ah, wasn't sure whether that had posted or not... Pressed the send button, then nothing happened, so I just closed the page and moved on.
    Oops.
    Looks like it posted after all.
    *ahem*


    Snoody :sorry:
     
  20. NicfromSweden

    NicfromSweden FHF All Time Great
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    my friends are going to get me a borat bikini :D haha its going to be awsome!
     

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